He coined the term and began pimping them as "rare", which led to an era of collectors thinking the "Black Widow" was more special than it was. The "Black Widow" was invented and backhandedly associated with the "SS" (a spurious connection) by the aforementioned Ralph Shattuck (an early Luger expert/specialty seller). In the 50's & 60's, desirable Lugers all had wood grips. It was a term used to give some mystique to the "lesser thought of (by collectors at the time)" plastic gripped Lugers. There's no such thing as a "Black Widow". I was just browsing their page and saw that after reading the description at the top of this thread. Well sorry, I thought I was being helpful. If I understand correctly, they were only made for 2 years so they are pretty tough to come by. I gotcha, he black widow is a different animal. (I didn't realize I could click on particular guns and pull up an additional page.)ĮTA: This has kinda made me want a Luger. Where is the black widow? I looked through there and didnt see a black widow. I don't know if this helps but here's a listing from a dealer in my area that konws what they're doing. For GOD'S SAKES, your post reads like a listing on EBAY from a REALLY shady SCAM ARTIST. YOU can just CALM DOWN and STOP using RANDOM CAPITALIZATION so the REST of us can ACTUALLY READ the THREAD. I'm through with Lugers, the declining NUMBER of people that even KNOW WHAT A P08 is should give you a CLUE as to what the FUTURE collectable VALUE will be.and it ain't UP, believe me. I sold my last of 18 MINT Lugers last year, a FAKE Black Widow in 98% condition for $1500, So they are strictly safe queens and rich boy toys. FAKE BW grips will not have these threaded holes.and oh yea, The REAL BW grips are closer to Bakelite than they are to plastic.Ĭollectors grade Lugers are NOT SHOOTERS, NEVER shoot one. REAL Black Widow grips each have on the INSIDE a threaded hole that serves as a STORAGE HOLDER for the grip screws when the pistol is broken down. Ralph Shattuck is a JERK and mostly, an IDIOT and not to forget, a CROOK, in my opinion. Most of the ones you will encounter are FAKES, but not all. I am trying to determine, within $500 what the thing is worth.īlack Widows were late model end of production era P08s FACTORY FITTED with black plastic grip panels.
![1937 byf 42 luger value 1937 byf 42 luger value](https://gvx.blob.core.windows.net/item-images/value-p-1257697.jpg)
It also comes with a correct year holster, take down tool etc. This is one from 42 IIRC, it is all black with the plastic grips and includes 2 correct magazines. I was familiar with the where the term "Black Widow" came from. This was an American invention, and had no German basis at all! German collectors say "Huh?" sometimes, when you mention the term! Shown below is an example of a "Black Widow". Some of the 1940 vintage (a very few), and 41/42 Lugers had them also, but primiarly the "byf" with black grips are a "Black Widow". These guns have a black salt blued finish, black grips, and all blued (black color) small parts (trigger, safety lever and take down lever). This was simply a marketing tactic employed, and the phase was coined by Ralph Shattuck (he tells me). Typically a 41 or a 42 dated chamber Mauser, toggle coded "byf" with black plastic grips (on about 20% of them).